Finding New PPC Channels

This week Matt Umbro (@Matt_Umbro) came up with yet another great question set titled “Finding New PPC Channels.” The following is the transcribed Streamcap from the live chat:

Q1: How do you know when you’ve hit a plateau with both Google AdWords and Bing Ads? Why?

  • Usually the CPA required to get more conversion volume becomes higher. – Robert Brady (@robert_brady)
  • After trying many new ideas (through audiences, new KWs, etc) you aren’t increasing qualified traffic. – Matt Umbro
  • When metrics stay relatively flat & client continues to ask “What have you done for me lately?” – Nicole Mintiens (@Tregesy)
  • There’s not much room for additional impr. share and the cost for minimal additional traffic is high. – Heather Cooan (@HeatherCooan)
  • Qualified Traffic Plateaus Maybe. Sustainable Costs are always there. Conversion Plateaus – NEVER! – Andrew Bethel (@AndrewPPC)
  • When results have been flat for several months in a row and you’ve drained your well of new segements to try. – James Svoboda (@Realicity)
  • I can’t think of any more new web page split-tests/ways to increase the visitor value. (Never happened.) – Steve Gibson (@stevegibsonppc)
  • Relies on diminishing returns. If G & B are at a certain CPA/ROI & other changes aren’t helping, then look to other channels. Don’t have to “max out” G & B before looking elsewhere. If there are better stats somewhere else with less effort, that’s gold. – Michelle Morgan (@michellemsem)
  • Also, client goals sometimes dictate non-G/B campaigns. Social, for example. – Melissa Mackey (@Mel66)
  • Yield curve shows there is no room to grow the number of sales/leads without an increase in CPA. – Jordon Meyer (@jordonmeyer)

Q2: Which platform (Twitter, Gemini, etc) do you believe to be the next most logical area of expansion after Google and Bing? Why?

  • Not sure there’s one answer to that. For some it’s social, for others 3rd tier. – Melissa Mackey
  • Depends on target audience. I often move to social (FB/LI/Twitter) or to third party display. – Heather Cooan
  • Being in ecomm PPC I’ve found the next logical step is FB retargeting, especially through dynamic product ads. – Matthew Umbro
  • Really depends on client. Facebook or LinkedIn typically is next for us. – Tyler Purcell (@tylerpurcell)
  • Facebook is a no-brainer, retargeting and feed ads. Yahoo Stream or YouTube retargeting are also easy stacks. – Jordon Meyer
  • I have seen some good results with LinkedIn & Facebook. But it certainly depends on the client. – Christina Hall (@Chrissie_Hall85)
  • Tough one. depends on the client’s market, if they’re primarily B2C or B2B and what they are looking to accomplish. – Cassandra McClure (@imcassy)
  • For B2B go LinkedIn. For B2C go Facebook or Twitter. – Robert Brady
  • AdRoll – Matt lukens (@mmlukens)
    • Only for FBX, I don’t like them for general retargeting. – Heather Cooan
  • It’s all about eZanga guys. No but seriously it’s usually Facebook first for B2C. – Jesse Semchuck (@jessesem)
  • We’ve had great results on Twitter, high engagement, low cost & purchases made.Location targeting needs improvement. – DBD Media (@dbdmedia)
  • Retargeting, display, and fb ads work well for B2C. – Jonathan Ng (@ThankYouJon)
  • Serious answer: facebook is the only other network I use. But, to me, it’s not a way to expand PPC (because it’s so different). – Steve Gibson
  • When Apple decide to release their own search engine it will be a game-changer. Until people go there to buy stuff, Facebook & Twitter will never be a logical extension to Adwords/Bing. – Michael Madew (@IntelligentPPC)
  • Twitter. You can target audiences via KW. Also target followers of specific handles who are key influencers for specific KWs. – Katy Pit (@katypit)

Q3: What is your overall feeling on the bevy of remarketing platforms available for advertisers? Do any stand out?

  • Criteo is great. Perfect Audience & AdRoll for FBX. Fetchback has fallen behind. – Heather Cooan
  • I’ve heard good things about Perfect Audience. Haven’t had time to test them yet. AdRoll is my go to for FBX (NOT GDN EVER). – Andrew Bethel
  • They’re generally fine. Retargeting is retargeting. – Steve Gibson
  • Look for a remarketing platform with lots of transparency. Most hide behind their black boxes. – Jesse Semchuck
  • If your website is good enough to convert the first click you will never need remarketing. – Michael Madew
    • Especially in ecomm, no matter how great your site, people will always look for better pricing. – Matt Umbro
      • Or to purchase again. Or to buy complementary items. Or to be notified of new stuff. – Melissa Mackey
  • I used AdRoll to access FBX, but now use own pixel. – Steve Cameron (@adventcom)
  • How does everyone feel about Steel House? I haven’t used them but am interested in hearing feedback. – Matt Umbro
    • Not a good one. Criteo is way better. Inventory was super remnant. Same issue I have with AdRoll. – Heather Cooan
    • Not familiar with steelhouse, I have been getting good results with AdRoll. I have found remarketing to abandoned cart segment has the highest ROI… low hanging fruit. – John Redfield (@John__Redfield)
  • I think native is king for remarketing. MediaMath is good for big budgets. AdRoll is limiting, but easy to get started. – Jordon Meyer
  • Don’t be afriad to ask what % of ads will be above the fold and if below the fold get a lower VTC %. – Jesse Semchuck
  • Oh! Media Forge is another platform I’m having luck with. They’ve kinda got cross-device figured out. – Heather Cooan
  • DSPs like TheTradeDeskInc are the way to go. A lot of set-up required but more transparency than anything else I’ve seen. – Michael Henderson (@innuHendo)
  • I would rate Perfect Audience first based on campaign performance, level of support, as well as UI navigability.  IMO, some remarketing platforms are comically bad. Had horrible exp. with one in particular (i.e. uploaded the wrong ad URLs). – Katy Pit

Q4: How do you go about getting client buy in for trying new PPC channels?

  • Generally, if you are showing great results in AdWords and/or Bing clients will trust your judgement & be willing to test. – Matt Umbro
  • Usually after we’ve proven our worth in standard channels they’re eager to throw money at us. – Heather Cooan
  • Demonstrate past success in a similar niche. – Michael Madew
  • I outline the benefits (of Facebook). They buy into it or don’t. – Steve Gibson
  • I would also tell clients that new channels are a way to hit new audiences! – Matt Umbro
  • Establish trust; provide case studies if needed. Usually if they trust you, they’ll try it. – Melissa Mackey
  • Make pain point crystal clear, show how new channel can help solve problem. – Amy Middleton (@amyxmiddleton)
  • Usually try it in-house first, then it’s easy to estimate investment/results. If it’s completely new, I outline the risks. – Jordon Meyer
  • Case studies about a clients vertical usually help. Fairly easy to get through any platform you’re looking to use. Also, if you’re client’s competitors are advertising on FB, TW, etc. it’s easy to get them on board. – Michael Henderson
  • It’s really easy when your work is good and have a good standing client relationship. – Michael Knight (@MichaelAKnight)
  • Step 1: Prove existing channels work. Step 2: Provide insights into new segments. Step 3: Ask if test budget is available. – James Svoboda
  • Minimize the risk by testing a small budget. – Jonathan Ng
    • Sometimes this kills the opportunity, if the test is too small. – Heather Cooan
  • As long as there’s research, reasoning & thought behind your reccos (and previous successes), there’s no reason not to trust. – Katy Pit

Q5: Talk about a lesser known paid search channel that you believe others should be using?

  • AskJeeves has killer ROI for my vertical. In all honesty, I can’t think of anything that hasn’t already been mentioned. – Andrew Bethel
  • I think Perfect Audience is lesser known and we get great results on FBX with this platform. – Heather Cooan
  • Honestly, people may know about LinkedIn, but I still feel it’s criminally underused in the industry. – Robert Brady
  • No one has mentioned Amazon yet…great potential here. – Matt Umbro
  • While not “search” I think using CRM data to “retarget” & build “look alike audiences” is where a big part of future lies. – Bryant Garvin
    • This is huge. AdRoll can do this via Email, others can do it via physical address. – Andrew Bethel
    • I’m not getting great results with Google’s similar audiences”¦ was very hopeful. – Steve Cameron
      • I am a FIRM believer that just because Google does it, it doesn’t mean it’s done right. – Bryant Garvin
  • I’ve had amazing results from certain mobile ad networks – not exactly paid search per se but lots of money to be made from it. – Michael Madew
  • Indeed[dot]com – Great advertising source if you’re posting jobs you want filled. – James Svoboda
  • Has anyone tried eBay Advertising? – Matt Umbro
  • Amazon product ads aren’t used that often…can be good, just low volume. – Heather Cooan
    • When you add product on Amazon, they outrank you organically. Also their ad platform is weak in my exp. – Jesse Semchuck
  • Amazon Ad Platform (AAP) Predictive audience targeting options are very unique. Bigger clients only since it’s an IO buy. – Jordon Meyer
  • We’re launching Yelp! and Amazon search ads soon. Little competition & relatively cheap! Would love to hear anyone’s feedback. – Katy Pit

Q6: How active are you with Amazon paid search programs? Do you believe the results justify more involvement?

  • I am very active on Amazon Product Ads. Great ROI the last two years with very little maintenance. It helps having very optimized product feeds (Amazon was one of the last CSEs we added) but the upside was huge. – Andrew Bethel
  • Usually do my best to talk e-com clients into them. Generally lower volume in traffic, but good Conv Rate/ROI. – Kirk Williams (@PPCKirk)
  • I’ve recently started with Amazon Sponsored Search where banner ads show above search results…you can target KWs here. With Amazon Sponsored Search you have to send visitors to your Amazon page. – Matt Umbro
  • Fairly active. They work great for some and not so great for others. Definitely worth a test. – Heather Cooan
  • Haven’t had much exposure to Amazon ads. i’m listening intently though. does it generally work better for B2C or B2B? – Cassandra McClure
  • Amazon Product Ads have always been amazing for my clients. CPCs continue to rise, but it’s not bad given the high ROI. – Jordon Meyer

Q7: Have you tried Twitter retargeting? What have you seen for results?

  • Not yet, but I believe Perfect Audience just added a solution for Twitter as well. We want to try it out. – Heather Cooan

PPCChat Sponsored by

Marin SoftwareUsed by thousands of marketers globally, Perfect Audience is a self-service retargeting tool that helps companies maximise sales and repeat customer engagement by retargeting lost shoppers on Facebook Exchange, Web content, Twitter and through email.

  • I think Perfect Audience is lesser known and we get great results on FBX with this platform. – Heather Cooan
  • I would rate Perfect Audience first based on campaign performance, level of support, as well as UI navigability. – Katy Pit


More PPCChats

Don’t forget to stay tuned for the next #PPCchat on Tuesday at 12 noon Eastern, 9 am Pacific and 5pm in the UK. Same Chat time, same Chat channel.


Check out the PPCChat Twitter list to see and connect with all current and prior participants.

• Matt Umbro (@Matt_Umbro)
• James Svoboda (@Realicity)
• Paul Kragthorpe (@PaulKragthorpe)
• Amy Middleton (@amyxmiddleton)
• Andrew Bethel (@AndrewPPC)
• Cassandra McClure (@imcassy)
• Christina Hall (@Chrissie_Hall85)
• DBD Media (@dbdmedia)
• Heather Cooan (@HeatherCooan)
• Jesse Semchuck (@jessesem)
• Jonathan Ng (@ThankYouJon)
• Jordon Meyer (@jordonmeyer)
• Katy Pit (@katypit)
• Kirk Williams (@PPCKirk)
• Matt lukens (@mmlukens)
• Melissa Mackey (@Mel66)
• Michael Henderson (@innuHendo)
• Michael Knight (@MichaelAKnight)
• Michael Madew (@IntelligentPPC)
• Michelle Morgan (@michellemsem)
• Nicole Mintiens (@Tregesy)
• Robert Brady (@robert_brady)
• Steve Cameron (@adventcom)
• Steve Gibson (@stevegibsonppc)
• Tyler Purcell (@tylerpurcell)

Finding New Streamcaps…I kid, this is the only one for me!

This is a guest post by Paul Kragthorpe; WebRanking SEM Manager in Minneapolis, Minnesota, #PPCChat Streamcap Grabber, SEO Blog Author. Connect with me @PaulKragthorpe, and Google Plus.

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